For the Canadian aviation industry, and for Avro Canada in particular, the traumatic story of the Avro Canada
CF-105 was paralleled by that of the contemporary British Aircraft Corporation TSR.2 in the UK. Both were destroyed by politicians who,.in 1957, were convinced that missile technology had advanced to a stage when manned interceptor aircraft would no longer be needed. The first stages of development of a new two-seat all-weather long-range interceptor for the RCAF began in early 1953, at the time when the RCAF was busy forming its first CF-100 squadron. This was not an action that represented dissatisfaction with the capability of the CF-100, but showed an appreciation of the fact that something like a decade was needed to get a new high-performance interceptor/weapons-system into squadron service. Avro's design team tackled the new and demanding task with great enthusiasm, with the result that by April 1954 the company was involved in the manufacture of the first five Arrow 1 prototypes. The name derived from the aircraft's delta wing, set high on the fuselage. This had a sharp needle-nose, widening just aft of the cockpit, where intakes on each side of the fuselage fed air to two turbojet engines mounted side by side within the fuselage. The Arrow 1s were powered by two Pratt & Whitney J75s, but it was intended that the following Arrow 2s would have engines of indigenous design and manufacture, in the form of PS-13 Iroquois turbojets, developed by Avro's Orenda engine division, each of which promised a thrust of 12700kg with maximum reheat.
The first of the Arrow 1 prototypes made its maiden flight on 25 March 1958, and all five of this version were being used for development and testing when the entire programme was cancelled on 20 February 1959. A final bitter edict was to ensure destruction of the five Arrow 1s, one unflown Arrow 2, and four almost complete Arrow 2s. Armament of this latter version was to have comprised eight Sparrow air-to-air missiles carried in an internal weapons bay.
With techno-advances and updates the "Arrow" would easily have served for 30 years or more with little re-design necessary. It's cancellation will forever be "Canada's saddest moment in aviation history". Instead, Canada now uses American military aircraft with obsolete redundancy designed in on the drawing board. (Just like their automobiles).
Outside management by McDonnell, or Douglas, may have warded off the requests for costly revisions to the design, & for 'one off' systems.
I do agree that an economy version Arrow design should have been built. Cost plus contracts require the highest degree of good faith by both parties. 'Off the shelf 'would have saved the Arrow project.
Gee, it seems that reg is my very own cyber-stalker. ....cut and paste efforts. Hey reg! Why don't you post my review of 'amazing grace', . --------------------------------------
At the risk of offending my dear Friend Mr. Fortier I must point out that accusing me of cyberstalking & asking me to be his media tout, IN THE SAME SENTENCE. is rather illogical at best.
Besides , Barry, you couldn't afford my level of talent! Cheers Reg
The government did contract for Mcdonnell aircraft eventually, but MacAir never built any engines, fire control systems or AA missiles, all of which were dumped on Avro's lap. Heineman worked at Douglas at the time so he couldn't be a factor. McDonnell Douglas was a prime contractor for the Avenger II and ran up 2 BILLION BUCKS without producing a single aircraft. The name is now history. North American (rockwell) at the time was dabbling with the F-108 Rapier with performance to equal or exceed the Arrow (in the brochure). It remained a mockup only. Anyway, manned combat aircraft have been obsolete for decades now and we're all driving rocketships and talking with our minds.
here\\s an idea; HOw would the Avro Arrow have turned out if , in 1956-57, project mgt had bene contracted out to MCdonnel? Arrow performance at Voodoo prices? Built in Canada, managed & liscensed to America?
Back on topic, Avro led the way.It was years before General Dynamics and McDonnell-Douglas were sued out of business by the US government. Fairchild and Republic, grand old names, T-46. Big scandal, Fillibuster, Republic locks the door. Rockwell and the XFV-12, not as much noise but no more AC's in Rockwell's future. And Avro was there first. Everything that the Labour Party cancelled in GB, poor old TSR2. We had Tories do it. Proud to be a Canadian.
Your reply to Giordano Bruno's post: To insert a product link use the format: [[ASIN:ASIN product-title]] (What's this?) Guidelines Reply to this post Permalink Report abuse 2 of 7 people think this post adds to the discussion. Do you?
Posted on Nov 29, 2007 11:34 AM PST Last edited by the author on Nov 30, 2007 6:35 PM PST Barry Fortier says: Not a valid comment, but I would expect nothing more or less from you, based on your own efforts at reviews. The desciptive terms used, are without exception accurate, and justified as they describe very well, the non-reviews I am referring to. Your own efforts, such as: "At this point, denying the probable consequences of rapid anthropogenic climate change is an act of social irresponsibility verging on a crime against humanity, especially the humanity fo our children..... www.amazon.com /review /R2E9UWQTRRJD8
????Does anyone out there tranlate"fortier??" WTF do you MEAN, lad.....
Gee, it seems that reg is my very own cyber-stalker. You really do need to get a life. And a brain, and some education, and an ability to formulate an argument, as well as an ability to go beyond your pathetic and dishonest cut and paste efforts. Hey reg! Why don't you post my review of 'amazing grace', or a complete review of a book sometime! Oh, you don't do things like that. Right.
You are really one sad and sick puppy. Apologies to all real puppies out there.
On behalf of Giordano Bruno & all I hereby grant the Haiti State Zombie control & lifetime supply of Lithium to Mr. Fortier for his dogged stalking.... Giordano Bruno says: Barry, your smears appear on every review that's less than five stars for this book! Is there any evidence available that you've read even the books you stamp with your imprimatur, let alone any books that might challenge your ideology? Go away, Barry.
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In reply to an earlier post on Mar 10, 2008 9:48 PM PDT Barry Fortier says: When you actually start using your own name, perhaps you might be taken seriously. But then in light of your poor efforts at reviews, probably not.
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So Chris, and Marco, what do you think of the arrow bashing thiefenbaker shill, reg???
To be fair, I don't think much of many politicians, but the Thief was just too much. And reg? He doesn't get one thing right about the Arrow, or the Voodoo. So sad, it is funny.
And again Reg demonstrates his inability to understand english, let alone advanced aircraft. Or again just demonstrating his pathological dishonesty.
****** Hmmmm...Our reident slo-boy, barry fortier,is raving at Professor Lukasiewicz, in 'the present tense'... /over an eleven year old article..**********
I begin by referring to your fantasy world, and how hopeless it is to try to get through to you. Then, I take apart your sad reference to the second rate lukas, so no, I am not thrashing him 'in the present tense', you merely demonstrate you are dishonest.
No, that is reg, a clown who thinks having a glorified letter to the editor published (and debunked), means he has been 'published' on defense matters.
Pity you can't discuss aircraft, but have to attack those who know more than you.
It was political pressure from the U.S. that forced Canada to cancel the project. The attitude of "If you don't do this we'll ..." attitude and Canada got scared and had to cancel. Tons of U.S. pressure.
Not to mention absolutely no U.S. coverage of the Avro Arrow. And why? Obviously to kill the hype over the plane. Why else would the U.S. continuously cover the Russians achievement of putting sputnik into space? They were scaring their population. Again who wants to listen to their great neighbor to the north when all they now care about is what are the russians going to do next?
Sad and much too bad for Canada.
Also the Arrow was only 2 weeks from flying with the most powerful engine in the world and breaking all American height and speed records. The Americans were working fast and furious to kill the project as fast as they could.
The exact fuel injection system was used on the Concorde not to mention the Iroquois engine that was smuggled over for engine testing in the concorde programme.
I'm not surprised Canadians are angry and even Canadians who were born after the fact. It's the same kind of gut feeling you get when you decided not to play the numbers for the lottery and they came up.
The Americans wanted a piece of that pie and Diefenbaker was their man! And don't think I didn't notice who has air superiority today?
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